Hebes Question
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tommyb
Location: Oregon, Willamette Valley
Posted: Nov-10-2004 at 10:42am
This fall has seen some major changes in my southern "side yard" (city says corner lots have no back yard!!). The twenty plus year old patio started wobbling when I walked across it, so out and away it went. The new pour, professionally done, has a height of almost a foot at the outside edges, another fall danger.
So I bordered the patio with a planter, twenty four inches wide, to at least visually warn folks of the drop off.
I'm thinking of an evergreen Hebe hedge, about eighteen inches tall, up to the twenty four inch width.The length is about thiry feet. I've already put Stella Del Oro daylilies at the corner, having plants from dividing.
I've done some Google searches,without great success. Any experience with these plants in full sun, east and south exposure, pretty hot temps in summer, would be greatly appreciated.
TIA,
Tom
JeanneK
Location: Oregon, Greater Portland Metro
Posted: Nov-10-2004 at 12:52pm
Hebes and Stella D'Oro daylilies. Wow, that would be a great combo. Which hebe/s do you have? Looks like hebes inhabit many different climates in New Zealand, from wet to dry conditions. Here's an interesting website on hebes. However, after checking out this website and Joy Creeks', you are right there isn't a lot of info on needed soil and irrigation requirements. I guess it depends on which hebe you have.
I have several. I love the different leaf textures. They are in a somewhat dry portion of the garden, getting 6 hours of sunlight but shade during the hot part of the day. So I have not tested them in hot SE exposures. Hope that helps a little?
Jeanne
tommyb
Location: Oregon, Willamette Valley
Posted: Nov-10-2004 at 1:23pm
Thanks Jeanne. I don't have any Hebes yet, but if the Stellas will look good with some, I'll add that to the plus side of the ledger. The Stellas were due for division, and they are rebloomers, so they went into the planter.
The website is one which Google gave me, but as you noticed, info is a bit scant for our area. I had the time, so I just returned from a "plant cruise" through a local developement, just peeking at plantings. I found one Hebe, but a bit large for my project. Then I wandered down the road to the OSU Aggie station in Aurora, Oregon. I'm in Wilsonville, so it's actually just outside the city limits.
Having no fear, I wandered into their office, as the signs told me to, and asked "Do you folks have any Hebes in a test bed?" Well, if the Hebe\Stella combo is good and luck is running with me, I guess the quarter acre test bed of forty or more Hebe varities is a miracle. With labels and stuff. I haven't searched the Station website to see if they discuss the tests in detail, and even more to the point, if any body is selling the stuff regionally, but, wow, what an amazing adventure!!
I guess, if no sources present themselves, I could beg them for cuttings...but I will reference the photos I got with Joy Creeks stock.
On with the search. Thanks again, Jeanne.
Edit: OK, so here is
Hebe Test Beds
So much for poor research. (blushing I am)
Tom
DebbieTT
Location: Washington, Kitsap Peninsula
Posted: Nov-10-2004 at 2:14pm
The one I think is exceptional is Hebe 'Autumn Glory'. But mine is not next to hot baking slab of concrete. Which may may keept the area around it warmer in winter.
Why I like it is its burgundy-red stems and leaf margins, and of course the beautiful flowers in fall. Its in full sun all day and is on top of a rock wall that faces south and west.
Is your heart set on Hebe? It seems to me a Mediterranean plant would be very suitable in those conditions. I would even consider Parahebe, a perennial with evergreen foliage that looks similiar to eucalyptus leaves, purple flowers and can take a baking position. If it needs to be a shrub perhaps Lavender or even Rosemary can take the heat. Both of them will not mind the leaching of the concrete either.
tommyb
Location: Oregon, Willamette Valley
Posted: Nov-10-2004 at 2:55pm
Parahebe sounds interesting. My selection is only limited by the micro-"climate", with size (eighteen tall by twentyfour wide) being important, and, as you identify Debbie, plenty of heat.
Hebes, as tempted by at a local nursery, looks like a nice alternative to Buxus or such. Maybe H. cupressoides Nana or H. Emerald Gem or Maori. I want a barrier to keep feet on the patio without thorns, and which matches the casual look of the cedar planter and surrounding raised beds. The lavendar/rosemary group might get a little tall and hide the drop off problem. Too short and stepping over might become an issue.
Thanks for any other ideas,
Tom
growest
Location: Western British Columbia
Posted: Nov-10-2004 at 11:58pm
Tom and all--I have grown and loved hebes here in a quite exposed (windy) location for several years. Gorgeous plants in all ways, except for their hardiness.
Mine have often been burnt by anything resembling an arctic outflow, or even by sun on frozen foliage. Never had a problem with summer heat, even with plants in containers on the blacktop driveway...do like to be regularly watered is all.
Maybe you southern folks never get the clear, cold weather that has challenged my hebes, if so, you should have no problems. In my garden, I just can't plant them where they will get morning sun in winter, leaf burn happens even in quite mild winters for me.
The larger leaved varieties are more attractive, IMO, but do require some pinching to keep them from getting leggy. That hebe society website is so extensive, shows we can't begin to tap into all the varieties out there!
Glen
tommyb
Location: Oregon, Willamette Valley
Posted: Nov-11-2004 at 7:05am
Thanks for pitching in Glen. My area is a bit different from the classic PNW,warmer and drier than Portland, and we seldom, if ever, have the frigid winds that the Columbia Gorge provides, so your info sounds like Hebes might do just fine. Well worth a try. The test beds I looked at did have several sections with just dead stems, so I'm not sure what varieties they were.
Have you tried shearing the plants? One vision I have is a mixed hedge of Hebes, sheared like the classic boxwood hedge,at about eighteen inches. A mix of texture and color, allowing the blooms to pop out then shearing back. Any thoughts?
I may have to do a Cistus trip. Their list is extensive and contains a few that I "photo" collected at the test bed.
Tom
Wanda
Location: Puget Sound corridor
Posted: Nov-11-2004 at 8:45am
Good information, Glen. I imagine there is a quite a difference in winters between your location in British Columbia and Tommy's south of Portland. But in visiting the gardens of southwestern BC, they look the just as "tropical" as Seattle and Portland gardens. I even saw a huge banana plant in Chilliwack at Minter's Garden. It might be explained by microclimates as I'm sure the basic temperatures get cooler as you go north and as you get further from the ocean air. As far as winter sun goes - who gets winter sun?
-Wanda
JeanneK
Location: Oregon, Greater Portland Metro
Posted: Nov-11-2004 at 10:29am
Tom, some hebes have a slightly fleshy leaf. My Hebe 'Amy' is almost like a succulent. I don't think those varieties would take well to shearing. Others have a more boxwood like leaf.
Have fun and good luck in your search. Looks like Joy Creek has quite a few too.
Jeanne
growest
Location: Western British Columbia
Posted: Nov-11-2004 at 12:14pm
Tom--the dead stems might be a result of last January's cold snap--did it hit you guys way down there too?
My hebes here all had to survive 10F for a day or so, tho they did all make it. The trial ground report from your area mentioned the tenderness of Xfransiscana variegata, which is one I have been growing. It is very sensitive, with all but one plant dying the first winter. I now have one very tough survivor under my tricolor beech tree, seems to get some wind/sun protection under there but came thru last winter fine.
Jeanne, my absolute favorite variety is one of the speciosa hybrids, either Amy or one of the similar varieties. I love anything that looks so good 12 mos of the year, and the deep purple flower spikes right now are a total and very welcome bonus!
No arctic outflows, that would be near heaven you guys. The one saving grace last Jan. was about 8in. of snow here, kept all my phormiums and even "tender" fuschias alive with no intervention on my part. Strangely, a smallish escallonia "Pink Princess" died right back to the ground in the same garden...live and learn, and learn, and...well, you know
Glen
tommyb
Location: Oregon, Willamette Valley
Posted: Nov-11-2004 at 2:57pm
And Glen, learn I shall...
I had a wonderful, tho fruitless, visit at Cistus. The gentleman of English\Aussie\Welsh (I failed to ask) accent and I searched almost all their growing houses and failed to find suitable Hebes. What a treat to poke around with one of the most down to earth and knowledgeable plant folks through house after house of strange and wonderous plants. I'll never shop in the spring again. OK, maybe...thanks again, o kind host!!
Failing to find the rare and exotic, I assembled this collection of victims, er, plants for my hedge: Hebe glaucophylla and Buxus sempervirons Aureo-varigata alternating, for the outer ends of the "L" shaped bed; Hebe cupressoides Broughton Dome mixing with Euphorbia amygdaloides Purpurea to join the above to the Stella D'oro at the corner of the patio.
Yes I really shouldn't do to the Buxus what I will have to, in order to keep the size close to the Hebe et al, and I'm probably crowding all of these too tight in the bed. If one asks to leave, I'll let it. And I'll have to add pumice to facilitate drainage.
Thanks all for the help!!
Tom
Phlox
Location: Washington, Southwestern
Posted: Nov-11-2004 at 3:48pm
A Yahoo search came up with a site called Horticopia you might want to check out. I just caught site of it and want to check it out more myself.
Sorry this got sent after the fact Tom.
tommyb
Location: Oregon, Willamette Valley
Posted: Nov-11-2004 at 4:11pm
Interesting website, Phlox. As far as the timing, if I had patience maybe I would be a better gardener!!
Horticopia backs up the fact that a couple of my chosen plants may struggle in full sun. Oh well. Get tough or get replaced, I always tell my victims, er, plants.
Thanks for the help,
Tom
Sydnie
Location: Western Washington
Posted: Nov-11-2004 at 4:46pm
Tommy - I'm late I'm late... But you may want one in your yard later on??? I have the perfect hebe. She blooms and blooms and blooms. I just moved her in front of the lvng room window! I want more, too. What can be better than a shrub that blooms in the winter, too!!! In fact everyone needs this shrub!!! I have pictures of her blooming covered in last years ice storm. It didn't phase her. I'd of offered you starts But because of the wedding busyness my starts didn't work out. I'm starting more this winter- hopefully they 'take'. Ya know we have trading coming up next yr..... I'm eyeing everyone elses hebes- LOL-
AND... wasn't it Jeanne that I 'already said' I would get a hebe start for????
Here's a picture of my hebe: nicola's blush
I found her at a little nursery a few summers ago at Cannon Beach... I can't remember what nursery. Seems like a mom & pop little business. It seems like they had them planted along the main drag there. I know there wasn't much info- and I was afraid she wouldn't survive my winters up here. LOL>> Too Cool- she thrived !!!
Dave's Garden has a bunch of hebes with information. Search hebe and it will bring up quite a few.
tommyb
Location: Oregon, Willamette Valley
Posted: Nov-11-2004 at 7:20pm
Seems like Hebes have a lot of fans in the world, Sydnie, but not a whole lot of resellers. Nicola's blush was on my list, but lookee lookee no findee. And from what information I have found via the web the plants are somewhat easy to crossbreed.
One of the reasons I'm seeking Hebe is to replace the annual madness. My seed starting in Spring 2004 complicated my usual annual display--the plants I started got huge, like twice the expected size. Makes it hard to plan the garden! Hebes offer a lovely bloom, some of them all summer into fall. Maybe this thread can continue and more Hebe info will show up.
Any body out there got more favorite Hebes?
I'm losing my resistance to asking: "Any body got Hebe Jeebees?" So sorry.
Tom
JeanneK
Location: Oregon, Greater Portland Metro
Posted: Nov-12-2004 at 7:41am
You just had to say it didn't you, Tom? Do you mean to say you looked through greenhouse after greenhouse and only bought a few plants? Wow, that takes willpower!
Sydnie, I am not sure what you mean here.
"Jeanne that I 'already said' I would get a hebe start for???? "
I might have asked for a start from one of your loniceras but not one of your hebes. But hey, I could always use another hebe!
Jeanne
tommyb
Location: Oregon, Willamette Valley
Posted: Nov-12-2004 at 8:45am
Jeanne I have tremendous will power. I didn't buy any plants at Cistus. The collection that I gathered was at Farmington Gardens on Farmington Road south of Beaverton. A true disaster for my wallet. Don't go there!!
On the search for Hebe info, I entered "Hebe drainage" in Google and found a great selection of websites discussing drainage and more temptations. This AM I am continuing my search for Nicloa's Blush and Hagley Park, as the Varigated Boxwood can go elsewhere. The OAN website is a killer for Oregon searching, jus remember to act innocent about wholesale: Oregon Association of Nurseries.
Tom
Sydnie
Location: Western Washington
Posted: Nov-12-2004 at 11:16am
Jeanne- I esp like the New Zealand site. That's where I found information on mine long ago. They have a huge selection to browse through with nice photos.
I know someone asked for a Hebe... LOL... back when I posted the photos. I tried to look- but it was too long ago. Guess I'll just wait and see if, and which, and how many of my starts take- and go from there with one of the future exchanges. LOL. If I offered already and only had one start take- I wanted to make sure that that person got one.
But hey my memory is awful when I get busy. I know I started one a long time ago that I gave away. Hopefully a lot of them do well- and I'll have lots to share.
That last link you gave Tommy- Nice information.
Red Hare
Location: Oregon coast
Posted: Nov-12-2004 at 2:52pm
I took six cuttings of a hebe I have, and three of them "took". This was one of my first attempts at rooting cuttings and I did it late in the year, so I was pleased. I'm guessing that if you start in the spring when things are warming up, instead of cooling down, you should have more success. They grew to gallon size in less than a year.
I love hebes - so much variety, and wonderfully scaled to fit a small garden like mine without having to hack away at it to keep it manageable.
Don't forget something with fragrance (maybe the daylilies have a fragrance?). Nothing like a balmy summer evening with jasmine or oriental lilies lingering in the air.
Sydnie
Location: Western Washington
Posted: Nov-12-2004 at 11:46pm
I think all cuttings do better in warmer weather? It seems a lot faster then. I have started lilacs, snowball bushes, duetzias, hydrangea's & butterfly bushes, that one hebe, and a couple magnolia bushes- that's all that comes to mind right now, over the winter outside in the garden and in pots. It seems really nice to have them come spring. Spring comes here when it's warm enough for me to go outside and not freeze! LOL. A thread on starting cuttings and such ??? might be real good. Hmmmm.
tommyb
Location: Oregon, Willamette Valley
Posted: Nov-13-2004 at 7:25am
The essense of my Hebes scramble seems to boil down to a new(?) fave plant(!)that the wholesalers I spoke with and visited all seem to have in propagation for next year. With multiple genus (genusii?) and multiple varieties in each genus (according to research), where each will show up is an out-of-the-hat trick. Some websites have listed Lowes as a good source.
Of course that's the reverse of the "I sold a beauty for a dollar yesterday" yard sale story, so it is just a tease. As usual, living in the Land O' Nurseries gives us a much better situation than many other areas of the country.
Just so I'm clear on the desired qualities: evergreen, year 'round bloom, frost and drought hardy, multiple flower\leaf textures\shapes and colors, fragrant, easy to root from cuttings and what else?? No carbs?
Seems little enough to ask...
Tom
Phlox
Location: Washington, Southwestern
Posted: Nov-21-2004 at 2:20pm
Coming in a little late on this subject but have a suggestion on obtaining the hebe you want. When I was looking for my Daphne burkwoodii and couldn't find the one I wanted, I did what I should have done in the first place. I went to my favorite nursery and asked them to order me what I wanted, It's now been in my yard and doing well for about the last 4 or 5 yrs, and, I have also gotten starts for it..........So, call your favorite nursery and ask them to get what you can't find.
tommyb
Location: Oregon, Willamette Valley
Posted: Nov-21-2004 at 5:47pm
Good idea, Phlox, but the way my shopping works is to run the little buggars down and go get'm. Currently I have time to go an unreasonable distance to acquire my wants. So far I've found the attributes of the varieties I'm looking for, even if in a different selection, if that makes any sense.
Plus, as a neophyte in rare and exotic plants, like Hebes, I can use the search as an excuse to visit nurseries with a "reputation" like Joy Creek and Cistus and Dancing Oaks. Interestingly, I've come across a couple nurseries that have excellant selection without the reputation. And carrying a list of specific plants so far has kept me from going too crazy buying plants. That may change, as my association with the Rainyside seems to be loosening my stoic and staid demeanor, or misdemeanor. You ladies are making me crazy. (giggle, giggle)
Tom
JeanneK
Location: Oregon, Greater Portland Metro
Posted: Nov-22-2004 at 7:48am
And by all that research, you've learned a lot more about the species than you might have! Makes the search so much fun! I have kind of taken that approach too but am using the web a bit before I run out to the nurseries.
LOL! Enter at your own risk, Tom!
Jeanne
DebbieTT
Location: Washington, Kitsap Peninsula
Posted: Nov-22-2004 at 10:57am
Originally posted by tommyb
"... has kept me from going too crazy buying plants. That may change, as my association with the Rainyside seems to be loosening my stoic and staid demeanor, or misdemeanor. You ladies are making me crazy. (giggle, giggle)"
We are here to serve. Gardening our choice of addiction.
cjmiller
Location: Oregon, Willamette Valley
Posted: Jan-04-2005 at 8:08pm
Hebe--I was introduced to a couple varieties from Cistus last spring, and really do like them, then in November we visited New Zealand, and saw Hebes in their native land--some were huge, looked like extra healthy rhodies-- some were dainty --there are so many varieties--so lovely! I am glad they are on so many agendas, as I want to see more of them in the PNW, in a nursery near me!
Carol
Gardening for the Homebrewer: Grow and Process Plants for Making Beer, Wine, Gruit, Cider, Perry, and More
By co-authors Debbie Teashon (Rainy Side Gardeners) and Wendy Tweton